"Coding school" project diary

just dumping some links here

Retrospective of what tech i teached my students during last 16 months and my observations. [not finished. just skeleton. will be an article later]

  1. From beginining i give my students Loopback course. ~ 14 people attend that course.

    [links to share]
    Loopback it is an expressjs + ORM(briefly)

It is good starting point from DB architect + backender perspective.

It have problem: it require understanding a lot of different/unique for student stack(unique for student, not a real dev for sure)

  • advanced express server development skills
  • dev should know ES6 syntax
  • testing(Mocha/Chai)
  • MongoDB
  • Pug engine - promises + callbacks

And DB skills, aka tables composition(1-to-1, 1-to-many, PK, FK, etc) -> they struggle here.

  1. Next was React Meal collection articles. Around 30 people attend it.

I moved content from tasks into a separated website. you can find it here: https://groceristar.github.io/react-course/docs/tutorial/intro.html

then i improvise with:
2) React + Loopback one student only and it show us limitation about connecting this technologies
3) Plain JS/ES6 module
4) React
5) React + custom react modules between projects
6) Testing via Jest - still doing it. going from plain js tests to tests for react components
7) Flexbox - i created a separated video course for Udemy/Skillshare
8) GraphQL - about 15 people were attending that course.

9) Git (https://github.com/ChickenKyiv/awesome-git-article)
10) ML practice

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Problems in my process. new part.

I want to prepare one major basic plan for interns(like a checklist), and it should understand not only what task they have, like(today you need to do this and in 1 month you’ll know how to do more)
but see what the next tasks are and see the whole picture and what other team members doing and how.
I think that it’s possible inside Github Issues, but we need to have will and time to do it.

So everyone will be able to see whole progress, that team doing.
I like an approach of one manage, that I was happy to work with. He managed a few projects at the same time.

Few of them were drowning and he sends each day/3 days - follow-up emails. At this emails he explains, what tasks right now I should work on. For me, a developer at that moment - it was a very comfortable approach to work under his control - I always saw and knew what I should do and in what order.
I don’t need to check JIRA, follow long conversations, etc.
My work just typed and follow his orders. just code whole days
His work was about reducing time, that I spend (and in dying project in increase costs for competition) he also tried to understand my workflow and tried to find a balance between his plan and my work.

He’s an asshole, he “forget” to pay for my team services around $300 but it’s not my problem anymore. He was from Russia, migrated to the USA, so I was not surprised. But his PM skills are awesome.

  • I should spend more time to apply an agile approach inside of my projects, and teach my developers to use them.

  • Part of team members have not only dev skills. They also have an active position and experience organizing work at Universities, campuses, communities, etc.
    We have to give more freedom to new team members, so they will be able to grab management to their hands and move projects independently.

  • We need to track developers, that start to think about leaving us. And find a reason, why they want to finish our collaboration.

At most cases, people are busy or don’t like my approach. It can be default fatigue or don’t have free time to learn new things, personal situations, etc…

Curious question for me - how quickly to figure out the level of their skills at the beginning. Because when I read at their CVs(I know JS, HTML, CSS, Java, .Net, Python) - I understand they don’t know those languages… It’s real life, not books, my friend!

I understand - their knowledge is limited to university courses. But how to make the onboarding process easy? Write more articles? Explain the logic of how GitHub works, GitHub Issues, Github Labels, GH milestones?
Explain how to collaborate, work with tasks, pull requests?

x) And only small number of interns are working with us for more than 3 months in a row.

  • it can be related to the non-paid composition
  • student can actively seek a full-time job with a salary, not experience and find jobs
  • laziness (why not?)
  • the complexity of our tasks, boredom with our tasks, that they cannot quickly solve…
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Great idea

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Today I get a question, what I’ll do if coding school will be a failure.
but I was ready to it and shout loudly, that content marketing is a cool thing, so we’ll publish more content at HN.
And I tell - that if 10 articles wouldn’t be enough - I’ll create another 10. and remember, that I decide to google a practice tasks, I start to google practical tasks in JS, because of it most simple that I can find.

But how to count success/failure?
We cannot just have some state about it. We need to have KPI -> this will help us.

  1. If I will see growth in numbers of new interns at first months in 2x - it will a good result.
  2. If companies will be interested to use our services - it’s awesome and
    will show to me that this idea is viable and can be monetized
  3. If for the first 3 months I will see “emptiness” and later I’ll see result-> this is just paused not the first momentum, so with right actions and using basic growth hacking actus in order to increase numbers that we have.

This is our current stats. Hope that after launch we’ll see an increase in numbers

I’m still conflicted. What project size/team size is ideal in our case? How detailed description should be, in order for people can start quickly? What size of description should we keep everything at Readme?

Before I did a few complex and detailed description, loud Readme, but with my interns. I didn’t feel it myself. like I made X work on docs and will it give Y increase and feedback from students.

As a manager, I think I’ll be forced to extend my skills with operating of the remote team. I should make calls, create videos with tasks explanation.

What is also not cool, that we have only progressed with tasks, modules, that I have high priority and focus. So, if I think that some module is not important at this moment --> so nobody working on it, which is strange and stupid. Because at this moment we don’t need it, but in 2 months it can be ready and we’ll be able to work, using that codebase.

When I watched Joe Rogan podcast with Andrew Yang(#1245)

I recall that @linh talk about it too some time ago. WeII, I actually convinced more, that idea of teaching people with my “method”(real project, practice on the first place)
It has a logic behind it. It’s not only about money at this project. Here are a mission and fun. Excitement as well.

My family packed with teachers. My aunt has 2 master degrees, was a teacher at college. teaching economics. later became a teacher in COding Academy. Then we got war and she became a low-level CRM coder/support & maintenance. And she told me nowadays -> teaching is a hard job.

I realize that only when I completed one course on Skillshare. I was really tired. Like squeezed lemon.
My aunt in her 40ies and tells me that she is not ready to overwork now, learn at nights, etc.

My mother also has 2 master degrees. She was a physics teacher at school and English for small kids.
Right now she is watching for an old man because her son is stupid and have “dreams”). My granny walks to school in father boots and was able to study only at 3-4 am. Because she was a girl and family have 6 kids, she was always forced to clean/wash/prepare food. She was a first at her family(and at the street where they lived in coal mining town) that get(actually complete) a masters education at university and STEM-related profession - complex electric machines.

So as far as I remember - my family was always teaching and learning. We have a lot of books on different subjects. When my mother was not able to handle me and I start to get Ds and Fs at Geography, Algebra, and Geometry -> she moved me to a granny home and at summers I crack math(i miss type it as meth - fun) each day in order to increase my skills.

So maybe it’s a good way to extend this idea of educating people. In my previous company I hired a lot of juniors, few were much older than me.

And their results were low and progress was slow. (They cannot compete with youngsters and more skill advanced employees, and we were forced to fire them later). So I understand how hard is to make people to code.

back to Joe Rogan Podcast -> And because automation is coming, and maybe #learntocode not so bad thing at all as it is(https://www.theringer.com/tech/2019/1/29/18201695/learn-to-code-twitter-abuse-buzzfeed-journalists).

because all IT people in my country realize that this is a sustainable future and(they driving all their relatives to the places, near coding jobs - managers, recruiting, lawyers, accounting, etc)

This is one of the reasons, why the recruiting level is low in my country :wink:

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our latest acomplishments with interns


Another story.

One guy finds me at AngelList. We are a bright guy and won Coding Olympiad in Ukraine. I think that he wants to join us, but he was just curious to know about what Ukrainian company doing at AngelList. And here I should mention that he was “talk down” with me.
And it pisses me off a bit. So, I think that I need to share this. I think that coding Olympiads in Ukraine is bullshit.

(Ok, Ok, don’t kill me quick, please - it’s my opinion). Again, coding, not science Olympiad, like physics, mathematics.

Why? I have a lot of good friends from India. They are bright people and it’s an honor to know them. They are popular students at their university.

Why? They took part at Amazon Hackathon and code bots/assistants for Amazon Echo.

They worked on real practical problems. They work in a team and compete at the tough competition. And win. Took first places and get few USD grans at their hands.
Become an Amazon Influencer Students. And it’s in 1000 times more important and valuable.
Cooler than our Olympiads. More prestigious as well. They can use their knowledge right now.

They can sell their skills and get a job. Make money. And be able to support their families. Or they can create a company, sell their products.
End of this story.
And I’m upset about it. In Ukraine, we have a great STEM education. But at the next steps: buildings worldwide useful products, promote and sell it => we suck.
Hope it will change in the future. Hoping for changes.

In order to onboard new students and work on some quick and simple tasks -> we need to improve our system of labels/tags/milestones in our repositories. Maybe data/good idea will be to merge some of our modules together into a mono repository on one roof.
Maybe it will help to update packages.
It will also reduce the number of our repositories/ releases and interns wouldn’t need to jump between repositories(but it can be a good thing)

But labels are the most important improvement for me. it’s great because will reduce numbers of these projects, will reduce the level of knowledge, while a new student will enter point to this project.

Tags/Milestones for different things: tests/work with arrays, work with objects, promises, React components, etc.

“Help us to build the next generation of engineers together with you!” - can be our slogan

Introducing a new member into the team working at the project is a hard thing. It not changing if the member is experienced or not. This is why maybe everyone like to start a new project.

Project structure/logic can be simple ==> but it wouldn’t reduce problems at the beginning. This is why planning is important. I also need to time management myself and spend more time on project documentation. Readme file will be our first point of information.

Next stage will be related to long term planning. A month ago my friend decides to join us. He is experienced, and grab to work on one module. By mistake, he grabs one of the modules, with bad documentation and complex structure.

Who is this problem?
He has skills, and should easily jump into this code. But it’s my problem.
So each member needs some time and a good explanation.

A good plan will be also a good helping hand for quick onboarding.

Just submit our company into two places where people looking for internships. curious to see what results it will show.
Going slowly with this thread. but will try to catch up soon

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Glad to see that this is a common problem:

Keyul is a creator of QuickCode publisher at Medium

Just published today.

Today i prepare and translate a lot of text for this thread. will type and drop it soon.

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An interesting and surprisingly correct/unpredictable approach for me - was to move all JS developers into one repository, introduce them at one main task and explain them our plan for that repository(I’m not actually sure, that this explanation helps from PM perspective, but it 100% works for team building)

But for me - explaining a lot of details I’m one place helps to structure my thoughts, related to the planning of one of our modules, that we plan to release to the public soon.

If I’m not working near PC or I don’t have internet, I wrote my plans to paper notepad. The first version always very crazy, and hard to read.

I wrote a major thesises, 0 details. It’s a thesis stage

Then, I’m rewriting that content again, so I can easily to read my notes understand what I want and what I mean in the next few days. PC usually cannot help me with management.

And don’t work well for PM work. Because I can create tasks in “excitement feeling.”

But students will struggle to digest that task description. The second stage is done.

Stage 3 related to combining a few tasks for one intern. So he can know that he will work on Task1, then Task2, then Task3…
With this approach, I can plan his workload for weeks in the future.

Later, when I’ll move my tasks from paper to GitHub, I also will create a few simple tasks from scratch.


  • “to add details to Readme file”,
  • “improve documentation”,
  • “add some tests”,
  • Fix todos or remove duplicates, etc.

Also! I need to have more focus on documentation. [I wrote an article about documentation] - https://hackernoon.com/how-i-set-up-a-startup-documentation-6af73287ee86

So, reducing time on my PC desk or without Internet I make more complex and detailed tasks explanation for my interns.

It helps my team members. So at this summer I should spend more time hiking and work on a fresh air without laptop and email distractions :wink:

I’m not just moving my tasks from paper to GitHub issue,s and creating big common tasks, like

[intern name][week number][title] links to tasks -> it’s also improving my workflow and whole development process, so I can assign one main task then add an “in-process” label to one subtask link with opened PR…

I’m sure it can expand the team and reduce my work for 20% (maybe)

Then I’ll be able to get back to planning our work for whole milestones forward. Be very happy when it happens. A notebook I’m creating tasks by these templates
[repo name] -> [intern name] -> [task name] - [simple description]

Then I can add tasks to Kanban boards - so it’ll be a really good project manager work.

I post this image before - but it actually related to this text :slight_smile:

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Our major part of communication is going via GitHub. If I’m online, and intern writes a comment, create a task, mention me -> then I received an email notification about it.
When I will have time -> I’ll reply quickly.

But please try maximally return to my information, or why do you asking my help. because I’m chatting at the same time as a lot of people.
So when I reply to you - in a few minutes - I’ll forget about what we were talking about.

Example of how to communicate better.

“I cannot do it” - sucks.
“I cannot to do A, because I tried B. Also C, D, E options - nothing works as it should be.”

This is my code, this is a link to task/ pull request, this is a link to codeline with an error(don’t share a link to the whole file)

How it looks from my side: when I assign a task to my teammate. I close that tab and switch to other tasks.

  • I assign you a task
  • You write comments inside at those tasks in the comments section
  • I’ll need to open that task online, check the code at the next tab, understand what do you want from me. etc…

All of this moves can be solved via code branches, pull requests, or pull drafts -> then I’ll be able to see your changes and at pull request comment sections we can talking
Don’t forget to mention task number, like #task_name(#100) -> task number and apply checkboxes at pull request description.

The sad thing is -> code review/changes requests is not a very understandable thing for interns/new developers.

Sometimes I just accept bad code(yep, sad) and then I create a separated task, mention the same person that should fix that problem.

It’s a simple and quick way for me but it’s bad for process :wink:

How I solve this problem? I add Travis CI, ESLint, CodeClimate into our PullRequests workflow.
So robots generating error logs that tell me and team members what should be done next, in order to make the code better.

You may notice that I’m a bit hateful/against basic courses and"default coding learning process.

In my country(Ukraine) courses are usually meaning entertainment. Their goal is to play with attendees, have fun and play.

My friend was a student at some local popular hard-core courses. It was about learning English. She passes them, pay a big amount of money(husband money - so nobody cares, right?)

But she still has a habit to watch translated movies on native language, not at English… Is this a problem with that course?
I don’t think so. The main problem is making a habit.
Instead of pushing a big pile of information at busy people in their heads. People, attending these courses should form a habit. People with habit will be able to continue.
a learning process later.
So they can benefit not only from 2 months of courses -> they will have recurring benefits from it. Imagine someone(me) who want to lose weight.
You offering to me a few free training sessions from trainers of Spartan race. At the first train I was exhausted, my muscles burn, etc.

At that time I was a pretty fit and prepared for exercises. I ran about 500 miles before it and completed a full marathon. So I was a fit person that more experienced in training. But it was not enough for me to keep with that page(and it’s fine because Spartan Race is not for everyone)

But if they will not have(If I don’t have) a lot of mental power to come back to you and continue training - they still will be fat. Because you didn’t form a good new strong habit. Actually, you maybe make it worse, because you showing(themselves that they are not capable to be like you or other fat people.

Yes. I so overtrained so I cannot mentally up my ass and go to the next training week later. You know that body response when you just don’t want to do something. It’s a normal reaction to it.

Next story.
I hired a sales manager after completion of “famous outsourcing sales” courses in Ukraine. Actually, they teaching good things. But they were playing in sales managers"",
so he was not ready to generate a result as a sales team member. He talks a lot and doesn’t listen(hear) me, while I learned how to sale on practice only.

I don’t have a backup or option NOT to do sales deals.
If I don’t close a deal then I wouldn’t have meals in a few next weeks. And you cannot be a sales manager, after reading sales""
blog posts with fancy titles “how and why and what and 5 habits of success” [screen from HubSpot sales blog.


So I’m only about practice. At least at first times, in order to start.

The first problem is to teach a student to think as a developer
The 2nd problem is to figure out what skills and how someone “solves real-life” problems

Here is another story.
I’m watching movies in English not because it’s cool. Brad Pit has millions of salary per movie. He busts his ass in order to act great. Facial Expressions, voice tones, bad words - each of this is part of his work.

It is drawing a picture, a character, that the director tried to show to the consumer in the end.
Using translations, you like removing 50% of it. Yes, we have good voice actors. But their salary will be a few grand per role, so you cannot compare a result and whole picture + voice frame…

[ We didn’t offer you air if you want a result, pay attention you can see what was done and how, and decide what to do next(and how to do it). This is a 2 side problem. ] - part of my slogan for the homepage. looks bad right? I didn’t understand it even myself. I should rewrite it

@Ali is helping me to make a more clean picture of this project. Big thanks for doing this and spend your time with me - really appreciated.

We have some conversations in PM. But i think it should be share here.


  • How are you planning to make money off it?
  • What is the exact problem you are trying to solve?
    Helping students to learn is fine but the amount of time and resources you spend for no real money in return is huge.
    I haven’t seen your OSS’s but I believe you also not getting any financial benefits out of them while putting time on getting interns to contribute? (which comes with way much more effort such as babysitting and holding their hand throughout the process)

My question stands “How are you planning to make money off it?” on the other hand students and interns have a very tight budget to purchase courses online or pay for further training unless they land a job.

brief answer is to get money from companies that want to hire us a babysitters. i was thinking about form a group of 10 people. and companies will be charged $100 per student per month. if demand will be more - maybe we will increase price. i actually didn’t explore monetization tactics a lot, but i understand importance of it.

Yes sure … I am struggling to understand the business model here, you will have to elaborate more on that.

Companies will pay you (coding school) to get the students you have as interns? But why would they do that and what do you mean by $100 per month per student?

Is coding school is going to be a recruitment consultancy for interns if yes then how per month payment from companies fits in?

I know I am attacking the financial side first before asking you anything else :slight_smile: but if believe ideas like coding school requires a lot of your time such as dealing with students and partnering with companies so it has to be financially fit otherwise you will be doing so much work but not making any progress by adding value to the market or getting stronger financially to lift your business up and if you gonna run funding rounds they will fail hence you will be confusing movement with progress.


if a company want to extend a team with software intern - they will face a lot of troubles of onboard a fresh graduated ex-student. Students may be good at learning or passing exams but will have a hard time to jump into ongoing projects. I think a lot of companies does not understand that. So coding school can help to test students before hiring them for full-time. I see us as a middleman between the HR department and incorporating junior into a company coding process.

But why would they do that

if they want to save time or prevent mistakes from firing juniors after the test-drive period.

what do you mean by $100 per month per student

if company want to test a student(test-drive for 1 month) or want to increase some of their skills(git/GitHub/task managers/get things done/development workflow) they can pay us $100 for one month(I didn’t validate that price - just cool looking number. but it looks not a lot of US companies by my opinion)

Is coding school is going to be a recruitment consultancy for interns if yes then how per month payment from companies fits in

interns that spend with me >3 months usually quickly find a full-time job. And I was thinking about helping them to get the first job by sharing advice. I just don’t want to charge students. And the $100/per month was just idea how this can be viable from a business point. I’m totally open to change that. Companies also can hire my battle-tested interns - this can be another source of revenue - my assumption.

a lot of your time

you right - it takes a lot of time

partnering with companies

another hard part for me. I actually don’t validate an idea from this side. Only saw a few companies at producthunt - job boards for internships

any progress by adding value to the market

For this project(i still have my food project) at least I see demand from students. This is what is moving me to this direction.

run funding rounds

will be also hard for me

Again - big thanks for your time - really appreciate that! it’s good test for that idea - this is how small project should be started from validation and good questions


just a few links for later

What developers will learn by working in my company?

  • collaborate with Team Lead
  • use GitHub issues as a source of information and place for communication with the project manager
  • work at different projects, different git branches, open pull requests, merge code together and resolve merge conflicts on practice.
  • will try to work remote and organize themselves
  • try their skills at real projects. Example. if you know how to work with arrays !== to understand how to operate with data, that was received from the server.
  • will be able to use Summer/Spring/Winter time at an internship
  • collaborate with someone reviewing their code and apply changes on request
    '- discuss plans or create a plan of solving problems
  • will work at stressful startup environment - it’s a very important and good experience.

Will learn to code by solving real problems on real projects. Not just building another calculator of the phone book in 2019.
I understand that a calculator is a great project to try a lot of different things and test your skills, but really - Calculator? Let’s do something more cool with us.

  • I saw a demand of people that looking for coding experience
  • Spend a lot of time of thinking about how to solve it
  • Create a plan
  • pick a lot of data together at one place
  • simplify a process
  • add content marketing in order to promote this project
  • think about the automation process - CRM/sales processes
  • publish my idea at different places like hackernoon, product hunt, indie hackers and start to collect valuable feedback
  • screens of how I’m creating a new company at AngelList, entering data, etc. creating jobs - displaying my articles there…
  • adding to my main profile, adding Linkedin - measure results in 5-10 days, months.

As a lot of default work(labor) will be automated soon - there will be a lot of mature people, that will learn to code and as mature people don’t have troubles in working - they will need another process, that will be different from the basic learning process.

They will want to gain skills that soon can be monetized - so they will easily skip a lot of important data, that you cannot to teach in a small amount of time.

Usually, it requires years for learning. But they don’t’ have a lot of time to do it.

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I think that I explain this before. But I cannot find that text. If you read my articles about interns you know that I was contacted by a lot of students.

And I made long interviews with them. And I think I can judge not only about local problems, that these students facing.

I’ve talked with students worldwide and everybody realizing that real experience matters most. You also need to know that only one local intern is actually from Ukraine. It’s so sad.

In Ukraine, we don’t have a habit/tradition, where students look for practice in spare time between semesters. It’s about mentality, traditions, bureaucracy…

Vadim(@vadim.putrov)(that the only one local intern) showing really big progress at my team.
Another guy, from his college group, was also interested to join my team.
Btw, I propose equity to Vadim, because I think it’s important to motivate and support talent and praise hard work.

So that second guy was interested in the practice, but later he realized, that his main goal is not to get a real experience. His goal is to get A`s at college and this is two different kinds of tasks.

While we learn in last year - Vadim received most of my attention and worked on so different tasks/modules/technologies - so he is now is a coding machine. For sure, he needs to improve his skills, no doubt to that. But in last year he masters a lot of things and his experience have a good raising bar.

I know how hard is to get As in college. I have all As in my college diploma. It didn’t help me to get a coding job but was a good foundation later.

I even wouldn’t start to talk about local teachers of programming languages. Their skills are quite ofter outdated and very limited. They don’t read the latest coding news or explore new tools. (I’m talking about most of them ~95%)

They didn’t follow trends and don’t have a real commercial experience.

We also have a lot of bureaucracy in our education system in Ukraine. When I was searching for local interns I wrote to a few universities as I don’t have shame to ask something.

Most of them just don’t reply to me. Other 2 teachers or coding professors told me to prepare a fancy presentation. So they can start a meeting, review my application, check my credentials(passport) - because they are scared.

I can be a scummer. So I should be very reliable because any issues with me can harm to their university brand. So they more interested to not start anything rather than fail.

Cave rules, so old fashion, you know…

Only one teacher was progressive enough to listen to me, hear my ideas and give me an opportunity to talk offline with their 10 best coding students. And I was happy to be there. But friends, via the Internet I can reach more people, talk with them via email.

It’s not about dozens of people, it’s hundreds of people, girls, and boys worldwide. And it’s more easy for me.
I don’t need to up my ass from my table in order to do it.
[link to student loan debt website]

I see a different situation in the USA. Ukraine has a “free” education + corruption in education as well. Teachers have a small offending salary and some of them cannot refuse to convert money into good marks.

In the US loan debt is a huge problem. And anyone, who decides to get a degree and got an educational loan, realizes that in 5 years he will owe to bank a lot of money. And they don’t have a lot of time for picking different career strategies or wait for a miracle.

This is why online education in the USA is a big thing. It is delivering result, skills, degree and save a lot of cash.

It’s not only about college costs. It’s also living costs and costs for preparing food. I was talking with one student from the USA - he found a food delivery startup to campuses.

Usually, students eating at a pretty unstable schedule and it’s pretty bad for health. And eating food at campuses costs them ~$1500 per month.
He wants to disrupt this market and with a big number of students that want to subscribe to a monthly delivery of food - he is able to deliver food from restaurants.

A lot of restaurants don’t have a lot of users - and it raises the cost of food there. But they can lower prices if they will have a lot of users. And students will be able to eat food with better quality, always warm and delivered in a preferable time.
Hope his project doing well - it’s a pretty good idea and market that is very profitable.

Actually, paid education in Ukrainians universities costs equally to Udemy`s nano degree program in computer science.

It also gives a pretty unique opportunity - people that finished nano degree can also pass exams in Alabama Tech University.
So people can have a computer science degree - it’s a huge and very competitive opportunity in the current tech market.

This is why they’re a lot of difference between US students and Ukrainian students. Each student in the US spend summers attending internships and 0 students wish or think about doing it in Ukraine.

They better will go to work to MacDonalds, have their hards burn and in a few months(2-3) will be able to purchase a new smartphone or laptop. Anyone knows that if someone has scars at hands - he was working at MD and burn hands by making fries in oil.

So US student that cares about their career - before finishing university/college and getting a degree - has a few records at resume about working in companies, from Fortune 500 list.

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